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> You agree to grant and hereby grant

I get that legalese is like human-interpretable pseudocode, but like, is there really no better way to word this? How can you grant without agreeing to grant?

> import, access, use, store, transmit, review, disclose, preserve, extract, modify, reproduce, share, use, display, copy, distribute, translate, transcribe, create derivative works

Wow this cover of Daft Punk - Technologic sucks.

I, for one, do not welcome our dystopian overlords, but am at a loss to what I can do about it. I try to use Jitsi or anything not-zoom whenever possible, but it's rarely my pick.



>> You agree to grant and hereby grant

"Hereby grant" means the grant is (supposedly) immediately effective even for future-arising rights — and thus would take precedence (again, supposedly) over an agreement to grant the same rights in the future. [0]

(In the late oughts, this principle resulted in the biotech company Roche Molecular becoming a part-owner of a Stanford patent, because a Stanford researcher signed a "visitor NDA" with Roche that included present-assignment language, whereas the researcher's previous agreement with Stanford included only future-assignment language. The Stanford-Roche lawsuit on that subject went all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court.)

[0] https://toedtclassnotes.site44.com/Notes-on-Contract-Draftin...


Yes, but the parent commenter noticed that and wondered about the other part, the "agree to grant" part. Simply "hereby grant" should suffice.


> Simply "hereby grant" should suffice.

Not necessarily — in some circumstances, the law might not recognize a present-day grant of an interest that doesn't exist now but might come into being in the future. (Cf. the Rule Against Perpetuities. [1])

The "hereby grants and agrees to grant" language is a fallback requirement — belt and suspenders, if you will.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_against_perpetuities


> How can you grant without agreeing to grant?

I think it's more that they're being explicit about the logical AND in that sentence. You agree to grant, AND grant them the permission.

I think it's a technicality about it being a "user agreement" so they probably have to use the word agree for certain clauses.


To whom at Zoom do we send the eDiscovery (and litigation hold) requests? My goodness.


set yourself up with a couple of vices [coffee, smokes] and have look here, for things you can do:

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37022623 [a number of links regarding how to play with bots and bork training by"malforming" your inputs]


And after that litany of very specific things, "and to perform all acts with respect to the Customer Content." Couldn't the whole paragraph just have been that phrase?


Not a lawyer, but generally when whole paragraphs aren't "that phrase" it's because people read loopholes into "that phrase."




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